The Great Food Dye Debate: Consumer Choice vs. Government Regulation

[00:00:01] Cameron:

Good morning, fellow food safetyists, and welcome to this, episode eight of the Food Safetyist podcast. My name’s Cameron, your fellow food safetyist. And it’s gonna be a bit of an interesting show, for this one. A lot to talk about. So I am getting the soapbox ready, because I’m likely to be on it a lot. So, anyway, let’s get all the the regular stuff out of the way and then see how my soapbox goes. First off, thankfully, there’s been, no recalls this week. Last one was the funny smelling beer packaging, eleven days ago now. And, it’s again, knock on wood. Hopefully, we can get through another week without, any serious recalls.

What else is there for today? There’s there’s been a lot of, excitement going on, within food safety, not just locally here in Oz, but, you know, I’d say internationally. And a lot of that has to do with and this is gonna be my soapbox thing. The health and human services secretary, Robert f Kennedy junior. And the, you know, the they plan to get petroleum based artificial dyes out of our food supply. And it’s a thing. It’s I as I mentioned in in previous episodes, I’m a devout anarchist. I don’t believe that the government should get in be getting in the way of things. I mean, you know what? If people wanna eat a petroleum based food diet, well, hey. That’s up to them to do it. I don’t think that the government should be turning around saying, hey. No. You can’t put that in food. You can’t put this in food. You know?

To the extent where actually, no. I mean, even if they did, you know, let’s say someone put strychnine in in, you know, or or, strychnine or rat sack or something in it for just using this as as a whole spitball thing and throwing it out there. And that got out into the public and all that sort of stuff. Well, then there would be you know, that could be a a breach of, you know, the implied contract law that, hey, you know, they’re making a product that is fit for consumption. And then there’s also the implication on the retailer to sell a product that is fit for consumption too. And if they’re selling a product that is, you know, tainted with rat poison, then you know what?

Go after them, and all that sort of stuff. So, so going back to the thing, I as much as I wanna see all this rubbish out of food, and if you have a look on, the additives list and everything like that that, the, FSA and Z, Fizans, puts out, food standards Australia, New Zealand. A lot of the stuff when you have a look at it, you think, oh, you know what? Should I be eating that? And, you know, it’s even coming back to the the, GRIS generally regarded as safe Just because it’s there doesn’t mean to say we should be eating it. And, anyway, take a couple of steps back again.

It it’s all comes down to consumer awareness. I think that the consumers should be aware of what’s going in their food, what they’re eating. Same as in their water supply. And, I mean, don’t even get me started on that one. And yet, we all just, hand over our agency to the government saying, oh, you know what? The government says our food is safe. The government says our water is safe to drink, and yet, what was it? A year ago or something like that, a whole lot of forever chemicals were found in in Melbourne water supplies. So, you know, it’s the thing. I think that there there needs to be a lot of consumer awareness and education.

Stop being, do I say lazy? And and believing that, hey. You know what? I don’t have time to read a label. I’m just gonna look at this and say, yeah. You know what? It’s safe. I’ll eat it. Yeah. So it’s one of those things on one hand, fully support getting all that crap out of the food. I mean, seriously, petroleum based. And now this comes back to the other thing too is is a slight political comment there. All those people that wanna get petroleum products out and, you know, pointing at, you know, and finger at a a number of of government ministers out there saying that, you know, we need to get rid of, quote unquote, fossil fuels. What are they gonna do with that? What alternatives do they have for that? I mean, you know, you have a look at all the stuff that is made from fossil fuels and, quote, unquote, plastics.

You know, recording this on, a Mac through a a roadie, bro caster board. And I mean, that’s plastic. There there’s there’s bits of plastic in it. There’s a touch screen that’s that’s plastic. You know, sliders that are plastic. There is a lot of silicone buttons on it. So, from from that, yep. Hey. You know, it it’s a thing. I mean, you have a look. You know, your pens that you write on, they’re retro chemicals, and all that sort of stuff. So on the one hand, fully support it, but then on the other part, hey. You know what? Let’s put the responsibility back onto the consumer is that, you know, they should be the consumer should be aware of, you know, what they’re eating and, you know, things like that. And it’s, it’s it’s one of those things that that, you know, the the consumer needs to take a lot of responsibility for it.

Same even to the point of the amount of of rubbish foods that we have. And, you know, in there because we’re what do we we’re we’re relying on the government to tell us what to eat, you know, the the health star rating and this and that and, on products. I mean, really, what does the health star rating have, and what what benefit does that have for people? I think that’s a it’s a pointless thing, because if you’re generally concerned about the impact that the foods that you consume have on your lifestyle, you’d be aware of the ingredients and everything like that. So the health star rating would be pointless. And it’s, you know, that old, what is it? That that old mean or joke or whatever it is where you go and see all these people stuffing their face in, with junk food from, you know, the the the various junk food shops, you know, chips and burgers and all that sort of stuff. But, hey, y’all, it’s alright because they’ve got a diet soft drink.

And, you know, it it makes you wonder. So yeah. So going back to it, I think a lot needs to be said. A lot needs to be done. I I would like to see a hell of a lot of ingredients removed from our food. I think as consumers, we’re being pushed by the majors into accepting products. I mean, you know, case in point, the the ugly food or the whatever they call them. I’m not sure what the names of of the the two different products are that that the, you know, Coles and Woolworths have. But it’s it’s the food that they know like, the fruit and veggies that they reject, but then they go and bundle up and sell it to you anyway. So it makes you think that if you don’t wanna sell that, the let’s say you know, and I picked a bag of apples up, yesterday from Willie’s.

And, I think they’re the ugly apples or whatever they call them or not quite right or I can’t remember what it is. You know? It was a bag of them, and it was substantially cheaper than the the pretty apples in the boxes and the trays and all that sort of stuff. So how much wastage is that causing? And, you know, as a result of that wastage, how much is that artificially in inflating the price of food? Because, you know, the farmer has to be able to, you know, make money and cover costs and everything like that. So if, let’s say, you know, an an apple farmer can produce, you know, 20 ton of apples or whatever it is, and that it goes through and, you know, I’ll pick on you know, I’m not gonna pick on a particular one. I’ll say, you know, Acme Supermarkets turns around and says out of those 22 ton, you know, only 18 ton of ton or ton ton of 18,000 kilos of those apples will be what they class as suitable for retail.

What happens to those other four? And then those other 4,000 kilos of apples, the the cost of them will be put onto the 18,000 kilos of apples that is there. So, you know, it’s the thing. I mean, you know, consumers, we’ve got to turn around and say, you know what? This is it. This is enough is enough. We’re you know, this is what we want. And, I mean, ideally, if you wanna do it, don’t avoid the majors altogether and go and shop at, farmers markets and things like that, or even find a a local farmer or some sort of, you know, delivery that will get you the the products, delivered to your house. So, that may be something that could be done.

You may be able to find a chip. You may be able to find better quality, and all that sort of stuff. But, yeah, I think as as consumers, we need to take some of our agency back, take take some of our power back and not, you know, have the supermarkets tell us what what, you know, what we could, what we should and shouldn’t buy. And, you know, this is up to also the industry groups as well, is that they need to start pushing out there. And, you know, call them out. You know? Say, you know, farmer Jay Smith was growing his apples. And out of the the 22,000 kilos of apples that he produced for the season, you know, Acme supermarkets rejected, you know, 18,000 kilos of it. For what reason? Oh, because they were classed as as visually unappealing or whatever it was.

So it’s a thing. Call them out. And then, you know, once the consumer becomes aware of saying, hey. Hang on. This is a bit ridiculous here. You know, you’re pushing the price of apples up because you’re rejecting so many, which in turn creates scarcity, which in turn, you know, pushes the prices up and all that sort of stuff, you know, supply and demand. But, yeah, it’s it’s something that we need to take our agency back. We need to take the power back as consumers. And, you know, kicking back to what started it all about the the food coloring I mean, yeah, let’s have a look.

The food safety, food standards. Let’s see. You know, there was that big hoo about, monosodium glutamate in food, and yet it is still in food. This gave presents published this in 02/2017. MSG considered safe and is unauthorized food additive in The EU and Australia in line with GMP, good manufacturing practice. So it’s the thing. How can I tell if a food has MSG in it? It’ll either have flavor enhancer MSG or flavor enhancer six two one. Ingredient labeling also applies to other permitted glutamate food additives, which have the added give additive code six two two to six two five. MSG doesn’t have to be declared when a food is not required to to bear a label, for example, in a restaurant or takeaway food.

So, you know, see, that’s talking about MSG, food colors. This is from May 21. Talk about intolerances and food colors. And it’s it’s one of those things. Yeah. I I think that we need to be more aware and turn around and say, you know what? I mean, okay. Here’s one. A spa team. It’s the thing. It says all scientists scientific evidence to date supports the safety of aspartame for use as a sweetener. However, reevaluation work is proposed. Now this was in 11/21/2021. A spudane was listed the on the JECFA variety list of substances. What is that one?

See, in 1980, JECFA established an acceptable daily intake of aspartame of fourteen milligrams per kilo of body weight. Two thousand and seven, a European study suggests that aspartame can cause cancer in rats at levels close to the human acceptable daily intake. EFSA, which is European one, reviewed the study and released an updated scientific opinion, and then says the sputane did not produce cancer, blah blah, and backwards and forwards. In 02/2013, AFC, EFSA, Nancy completed a full risk assessment, and the spotted and concluded it’s safe at current levels of exposure exposure. The risk assessment involved a review of all scientific research on a spot and its breakdown products.

So it’s it’s one of those things is do we here we go. Gotta pop up the list here. K. We have a look. I know I’ve read through it before. I mean, we’ve got different sorts of ammoniums, aluminum, aluminum silicate, silicate, aspartame, betonite, which is dirt or clay, benzoic acid, bleach starch, bone phosphate. What else have we got? Very commonium citrate.

[00:17:37] Speaker 1:

All sorts of weird stuff. I mean, gold.

[00:17:40] Cameron:

You know, ingredient, additive number one seven five. I mean, gold gold is a is a ingredient in an additive in food. I don’t know. It’s it’s one of those things is that we need to start taking responsibility and and turning around and saying, hey. You know what? We’re not going to accept that.

I mean, there’s so much you go through it. It’s yeah. Anyway, it it’s something that we need to be aware of it. We need to turn around and tell the pages and the the food manufacturers that, no. We don’t want this stuff in our food, and we’re not going to buy it. And we need to turn around and make a point of it. You know, the what is it? The hot fructose corn syrup, for that. And, you know, there there’s so many fillers and things that don’t need to be in food, and it’s just in food for who knows what reason. And this comes back to us as food safety professionals is that we need to start making more noise about it rather than just, you know, lie you know, just kicking back and wake waiting for his hands to do it or, you know, someone overseas to turn around and say, yeah. You know what? You’re right. Let’s get this stuff out of the foods.

You know, as food safety professionals, we should be hitting these places up. Just because the government says something’s good doesn’t necessarily mean it is. You know, these those of us who are old enough to remember of numb number of of times where, I mean, we can have a look at smoking as a perfect example of that for years and years and years. You know? We were told smoking was fine. Doctors were recommending cigarettes. Doctors were recommending a particular brand of cigarettes. You know, there was research that said that smoking does this and and, you know, is good for you. And, you know, there was this suppression of, negative, scientific information or whatever it was that that said, you know, smoking’s bad. And then once the executives found out, you know, they hid it for a while. And it’s the thing is that we we need to just be aware of it. And, you know, the same sort of stepping out of the realm of of food safety and into the pharmaceutical industry, it’s the same thing there is that as consumers, we need to turn around and say, hey. You know what? We don’t want that or hang on. Let’s be honest.

And, you know, start going after these people. And, you know, I I mean legally, and figuratively. I don’t mean it in any other way. I do want to clarify that is that they need to be held accountable for the decisions that they make. And, you know, the the the companies that do it go after the companies. And, you know, it’s it’s just something that that, you know, we we need to do, you know, to take responsibility for it, for for that. So, anyway, it’s a bit of a soapbox issue, and it’s not something that everyone’s gonna agree with. And I think as food safety professionals, we need to be, at the forefront of this. We need to turn around and and actually support these decisions, or we need to turn around and say, you know what?

We agree with it. This product comes from here. This thing comes from here. There’s a rumor it might cause that problem, but you know what? Yeah. It’s the thing. You know? People are relying on the work that we do to provide a product that is fit for fit for human consumption. And, I mean, you know, doing doing ingredient decks and and nips and things like that is that, you know, you you have a look at the ingredient deck on some products. And you think, what happened? What, you know, what happened to our products that we have to have this much stuff in it? So, yeah, you know, sub ingredients of characterizing ingredients and all that sort of stuff, it’s it’s it’s it just baffles the mind.

Yeah. So, yeah, we we we do need to become more vocal about things and, stop relying on, government to be able to or, you know, the the government to to create regulations. We as consumers need to be aware of things, and we as consumers and food safety professionals need to step up and, educate consumers on the things that are going on. For example, what is there? There? A lot of this you know, there there’s been, a lot of recalls overseas for E. Coli and salmonella, and all that sort of stuff. So it’s it’s something that is you know, it’s what would you say?

It it it’s just one of those things is that we don’t pay attention to it. Because we’re all busy, we haven’t got time to do it. So we just assume, and we know what happens when we assume things, that the products that we’re buying from the store will be fit for consumption. You You know? Because the government will never do anything that will intentionally hurt the pay you know, hurt the population. Well, remember what the government does with those who, have joined the armed services. You know, that’s yeah. So don’t don’t believe for a second that the government values your life or anything like that.

You know, and and I don’t care what level it is. I mean, we’re all just consumers. We’re all just numbers to the government. We’re all just a resource. And, yes, this is my anarchist roots or history or or or views coming out, but it’s the thing is that we need to be aware of it. The government is agenda driven. The government is influenced by industry groups. And case in point will be this bit that I’m gonna be talking about now. There was something I mentioned in can’t remember what episode it was. It was about, you know, let’s say welfare washing, for the, what was it, the labels on food about, you know, RSPCA approved chickens and and all that sort of stuff. So, this comes down to, what was it? This was in the Guardian, last week.

I I missed it for, episode, but I I forgot to talk about it here. So after some of the previous fiestascoes that, there were a whole lot of, requirements put on exporters, those who export live animals overseas, with regards to animal welfare and all that sort of stuff. Now according to this article, the Guardian did a four month investigation, and now it can reveal that hundred sheep died from hypothermia. This is in heavy run-in 02/2022. ‘1 veterinarian whistleblower described the incident as horrific and went unpublished, unpunished.

Animal welfare breaches went unreported to state regulators. In in a direct complaint to a former ag minister, one whistleblower vet described finding a cow that had a calf. Instead of reporting the incident as welfare breach, he said his superior superiors apologized to the owners of the abattoir after the vet intervened to help the animal. So this is the thing. You know, one vet has been diagnosed with PTSD saying they felt isolated and unsupported by managers, while others say that they’ve been vulnerable to bullying. It’s, you know, the 02/2022, a truck carrying 600 sheep. So this was locally from Victoria to Central New South Wales, drove through heavy rain and frigid conditions to get to an export abattoir, leaving the sheep on top of the trailer exposed to the elements. Truck traveled for nine hours in total, stopping midday for a welfare check with a woman transport company, and then carrying on for another four hours before a hundred and three sheep were discovered either dead or dying.

The incident was referred to Ag Victoria for an instigation. It closed the investigation with no repercussions for the transport company beyond remind reminding it that it was compelled under national standards to take reasonable steps to minimize the impact of extreme weather conditions on the welfare of livestock. It it comes down to actually, no. Firstly, I mean, why why are there vets in these industries? And, you know, what is the industry group for vets doing? You know? Will the industry groups support the vets if they turn around and say, hey. We’re not gonna get involved in that industry. You know, it’s like, you know, I’ve written The US that that the doctors that were involved in, executions.

I mean, how’s you know, that’s essentially a a conflict or breach of their Hippocratic oath, which is first do no harm. I mean, how can vets do this? It it’s something that’s that’s always baffled me, you know, how vets can be on this and then how industry bodies can turn around and and not jump up and down. But, anyway, it it comes back down to it. Is that, you know, this is all all, you know, greenwashing government agendas, government answers to particular bodies. Government is scared of particular bodies because of whether it’s funding or whether it’s, you know, the potential for, negative publicity, whatever it is.

And, you know, don’t don’t think for a moment that the government has your best interest at heart. It doesn’t. It only has its own best interest at heart. And I I don’t mean this one to be a bit of a downer of an episode for for food safety related stuff, but it is things that we need to be aware of. And as I’ve said repeatedly, we as food safety professionals need to be the ones that are there advising the consumers, hey. You know what? These are the products. You know? This is in this product. We need to be, I don’t know, form an industry group or something like that where, you know, we all just get up and we turn around and say, you know what?

This is it. We’re not going to accept it. The, you know, the industry group will put out a, you know, media release saying blah blah blah blah blah. But then, you know what? Maybe that’s a bad idea too because they end up getting influenced by advertisers and sponsors for big events because if if, you know, Acme Chemicals is a sponsor of the the Food Safety Professionals Association of Australia, you know, their annual dinner, and the association turns around and says, you know what? Chemical x y zed produced by Acme Chemicals is not good for us. We do not recommend that you, you know, be consuming it. You know? Are they gonna pull their funding? And it comes back down to the other thing too is that the power that industry has, and, you know, it influences so much, and all that sort of stuff. But, anyway, this is starting to be a bit more of a of a rant than I want to do, but it’s stuff that I think that needed to be said.

We shouldn’t be making noise about products. And, you know, as food safety professionals, those of us who are listening overseas, you know, don’t jump up and down and say, hi. You know, the proposal to remove those products is lacking detail or lacking substance. Turn around and say, you know what? We agree with it. Let’s move forward, and let’s put a plan in place or or targets in place to have it taken over out of food supply, and all that sort of stuff. But anyway, I think I might leave that one a bit of a rant there. Sorry. It’s been ranty. It was just a soapbox issue, for that.

Next week what am I gonna talk about next week? You might go a bit bit more under audits and, not external audits, but more about the internal audits that we can do ourself, within the business to make sure that we adhere to our our management system and all that sort of stuff. So anyway, folks, that’s about it for this one. Look forward to having you join me on the next one, which won’t be as ranty. So, until then, keep doing what you do, and, bye for now.