Food Safety Challenges: Pets on Planes and Cultured Quail

[00:00:01] Cameron:

Good morning, fellow food safetyists, and welcome to this episode six of the food safetyist podcast. My name is Cameron Blewett, and I am the host of this podcast. In what I can do, episode six, we’re gonna have a little bit of talk about, what’s happening in FSANZ over the last week or so. We talk about some prosecutions that are happening around the place. Maybe I’ll see how I feel about it. Make a make, maybe make a comment about the whole concern about bird flu and all that sort of stuff. And then, kick into the main part of the show, which will be, auditor management, during audits of your food premises. So without further ado, let’s get on with the show.

Yeah. Once again, there’d be music here. I’m not sure what what music I’m gonna make for it. But, hey, I’ll add some music later on. Anyway, so a little bit of a waffle there. What’s been happening in in FSANZ. So for those who came in late for FSANZ is the, food safety, correction food standards, Australia and New Zealand. There’s been, where are we going? Let me click on a few links here. The interwebs is being a bit slower. I am more importantly, I will while I’m loading all that up. This is something from a couple of days ago. Kmart urgently recalls a popular beverage product.

Now they’re recalling one of their, Anko coffee cups. This is more of something from the ACCC then FSANZ. It’s that these these cups don’t have a pressure release valve. So if you fill it up with a hot liquid and you close the lid on it because you know, you wanna make sure it doesn’t spill or anything like that. It has the, potential to cause serious injury. So the lid may pop off. And so, yeah, it cause serious injury. Actually, correction. According to the a triple c, an injury has occurred. Kmart spokesman spokesperson has urged customers to immediately stop using the product and return it to the store where they will be issued with a full refund with or without a receipt.

So there you go. That’s something good that, receipts will be issued. So free funds will be issued without a receipt. Normally, it does those things as you have to have a receipt. Otherwise, it’s store credits. And anyway, won’t get into that. Some things that I thought were interesting for presents that did pop up over the last couple of days, was a actually, this is from March. This is an application. So the, physence is calling for, input, public commentary on the what is it, a one three one four, permitting small dogs and cats in aircraft cabins. This application seeks to amend the code to permit companion animals, small dogs and cats, to accompany their owners aboard airline cabins under controlled circums controlled conditions.

The application seeks to amend the clause on live animals in areas where food is handled. This is clause 24 of standard three point two point two. It’s an interesting one. How do I feel about it? I don’t think it really matters either way, considering all the other stuff that goes on in in aircraft. I think a cat or a dog is probably the least of anyone’s concerns. So it should, which, you know, this kicks back to the, dogs and cafes thing that I was talking about a couple episodes ago. I think we need to start focusing on the things that, do matter and not these, little bits or these these little things, which are really, what would you say? In in a big scheme of things, they’re they’re a little bit inconsequential.

So case in point, having a look at, this is someone in Adelaide. So valley view chicken and seafood, the owner has pleaded guilty to failing to comply with requirements for the food standards code. According to the article, a business owner has come clean on keeping his chicken shop in disgusting conditions after inspection found mice, feces, cockroaches, and ants. And despite the disgusting state of the premises, Valley Chicken and Seafood, Valley View Chicken and Seafood has been allowed to continue operating. Yes.

So anyone thinks that the government is there to keep safe and to stop anything going on. So anyway, the owner plead guilty in allied magistrates court on Wednesday, 13 offenses for failing to comply with requirements of the food standards code. Charges followed in inspection of the shop by EHOs from Port Adelaide Enfield Council on August 2824. Court documents, like, it is alleged there were containers of raw chicken stored directly next to an uncovered bowl of prepared coleslaw and salad in boxes of custard powder stored in the pantry with vinegar flies. Jeez.

After the cons in another inspection of business was contacted on January 20, and officers found the conditions were again below an adequate standard of cleanliness, including glass fragments and mice feces under the salad fridge in the front food handling area. So even with all of that, the council spokesperson told the Adelaide advertiser their compliance with food safety standards seriously. Blah blah blah blah blah blah. And then the business has not been closed, and we continue to work with them to improve their food safety standards. What what can you possibly say about that?

I mean, you know, you you have a look at here’s this. Two two instances months apart where the council has gone in and said, yep. Hey, you’ve done something wrong and then still led to trade. And yet, you know, you have a look at, the whole slug gay thing. And that was closed with, you know, with a well, I I don’t know whether it’s been said in court or confirmed by the court that is a a planted insect or slugs or insects. Anyway, for the for that, I will have to dig up the the transcript and the recordings and everything like that to see if it was, you know, if it was confirmed that the the slugger was planted. But anyway, it’s alleged that this slug was planted, because it’s like a tissue paper on the the body. So anyway, so, you know, that happens then.

This happens now. So it does make you wonder, do these councils really can really care about food safety, or are they just in it for the money? Because there’s annual registration fees and everything like that. Always this part of a, a bigger problem. I mean, you know, I don’t know. Yeah. It’s it’s it’s one of those those big questions that, you know, you you do need to ask yourself. But anyway, so here here’s one. Having a look, where’s this one? This one’s from the Herald Sun from February, where it says, last year, 15 Victorian restaurants were convicted and slept with a combined total of $443,000 in court fines after they breach food safety regulations.

The 15 businesses were forced to cough up nearly 250,000 in legal fees. Comes as 13 Melbourne councils fined restaurants more than $460,000 from 306 infringement notices in 02/2023. Yeah. It’s it’s of of the 15 convicted Idris four have since shut down. The food safety register of convictions is a cafe in Ballarat One in Heighten, one in North Geelong 1 in Melbourne cbd, Carlton Q, another one in Geelong, another one in Melbourne cbd, Surrey Hills, Dandenong, Werribee, Clayton and Burwood East. But Victoria’s list of according to the article, but Victoria’s list of offenders for 02/2024 was not nearly as long as those in other states where unsanitary behavior and several rodents are ran wild Between January 24 and early twenty five two thousand and twenty four and 02/2025, ’17 Western food w a food businesses, including Hungry Jack’s muffin break, were convicted under the state’s Food Safety Act.

It it makes you do wonder what happens. And, you know, it’s is it something that, you know, we we should be relying on the government to do? Or is it something that we should be turning around and becoming more proactive and turning around and saying hey, you know what? We’re not gonna accept this and count you know, the consumer needs to be aware and stop. What would you say? And is it handing over their authority? Or just stop, you know, giving your authority to or your agency or your ability to make decisions for yourself to the government and don’t just, you know, assume, oh, you know, they’ve got a food safety license or they’ve got a, you know, pretty certificate hanging up in the wall that it’s gonna be good to eat at this place.

And it’s it’s the thing is that, you know, it’s it’s it’s it’s the thing, stuck on repeat there. I think that we should really start as consumers. And and this is what my consumer had on now is be more aware of what’s going on everywhere, not just, you know, where we get our takeaway food and things like that, but becoming more aware of the the whole, I I won’t I won’t use the the farm to play thing, but it’s more about we need to become informed about the whole supply chain thing. And, you know, this this talk about the trade war in between The US and China and all that sort of stuff is case in point. How much are we as Australia relying on imported products, you know, for for go through the shops.

Actually, let’s I wonder if I can do that now. It’s gonna say, oh, you know, you you pick a shop and then you have look at a product and see if it’s, you know, where it’s made. And, you know, there’s the whole, what is it country of origin labeling and everything like that. Well, you know, I to to some extent, I can understand and, you know, sort of agree with that that, you know, there should be country of our origin labeling and all that sort of stuff on on products because, yeah, you need to know where where the products are coming from. I’m I think that it’s time that we started paying more attention and, you you know even turning around to the majors where we you know most of us buy our products from and say that you know what this is enough.

You know, we we we demand we demand we expect these things to be, you know, you know, produced or made locally. And, you know, it’s the thing is have a look at how much government funding these organize you know, these these majors get. And, you know, you can talk about funding whether it’s direct funding, through, what is it, through incentives and and all that sort of stuff, or it can be, you know, government funding. And, you know, let’s let’s make it clear. If we if the had any capacity or any ability to improve the the shopping experience for us, you know, there it’s something something seriously we’ve done to break up this duopoly.

And the, you know, the all all the bluff and bluster by the Labour government to say that, you know, we’re going to, make shopping easier and and, you know, reduce cost of living and all that sort of stuff. That’s a little bit of bollocks. But, anyway, this isn’t gonna be political. It’s it’s more of a if the thing is that there’s just more stuff that I think needs to be done, and it’s up to us as consumers that we need to be aware of it, and we need to turn around and say, you know what? That’s it. Enough is enough. You know, we expect and, you know, demand that our, produce is making and and by the other other side of the coin too, is that as consumers, I think that we need to, turn around and and accept that there’s going to be a little bit of pain involved in that. I mean, you know, if something comes from overseas and it’s, you know, able to be produced, substantially cheaper. Most people in this cost of living crisis, it will take the cheaper option.

But I think that we need to be aware of the long term cost with that. So yeah. But anyway, this this wasn’t a big, political rant. I’ll leave that for a different show or something like that. But anyway, it’s it’s a thing. So, yeah, I think we need to make more attention about where we what we do, where we eat, and and and things like that. So, anyway, coming back to physanz. Here’s something interesting, that came out on the ninth. So first cell cultured food approved by physanz board. Cell cultured quail is a step closer to being on restaurant menus following its approval by the food standards, Australian New Zealand board. The approval process now moves on to food ministers. I have sixty days to consider the decision.

This means that there’s an application for cultured quail to be listed as an as a novel food. Obviously, novel means it’s something that hasn’t been, you know, done before anything like that. So it says under the approval, cell cultured foods will be labeled as cell cultured or cell cultivated to support informed consumer choice. If food ministers do not request a review of the decision, Australia and New Zealand will join a select group of countries in improving food made from cultured animal cells. What do we make of that? Honestly, I don’t think I’m interested in it.

Obviously, you know, I I think I let it did let it slip out in previous episode that I’m vegan. So I have no interest whatsoever in consuming cultured quail. Even if you do turn around and tell me that, hey, it’s vegan. You can eat it because an animal didn’t die and and all that sort of guffawful. You know what? I’m still not interested in eating it. It could have, you know, vegan approved stamps all over it, and, no, still does not interest me. And I think I don’t think I’ve even tried the impossible burger or anything like that either. I don’t think anyway, I can’t remember. I’m pretty sure I haven’t. But, anyway, as a consumer, well, you know what? You’ve gotta make your choice up.

You’ve gotta decide, you know, is it is it something that you wanna do? Is it something you wanna try? Is there a risk? Well, who knows? I mean, you know, if there’s risks in anything, you drink too much water, you can can you dream? I don’t know. I think excessive water consumption does have problems, for that one. I don’t know. I mean, what would it taste like? I have anyway, I had no interest in it. I just thought, hey, you know, it’s something interesting to talk about. The other one that I did want to mention was, I can’t find it. Nope. It’s disappeared.

Yep. It’s disappeared. There’s another news release from the ninth, what we heard informing the future of nutrition labelling. So they’re talking about, the house star rating and nips. Is it is it something? I mean, I don’t know. I mean, I think the house tie rating isn’t all that it’s cracked up to be. The the nips. Yeah. Well, I think that they do possibly serve a purpose. Honestly, I don’t look at it. You know, I need I’ve never, as a consumer, looked at a nip and considered the, you know, the the information that is in that panel. Why?

Because honestly, you know, I’m not worried about counting this and counting that. And, oh, it’s got you know, something got too much of this and something got too much of that. Yeah. Just leave it. Anyway anyway, moving right along. Am I going to wanna make a little bit of a comment. You know, obviously, I subscribe to a lot of international food safety and and food standards and and all that sort of stuff, publications. And people are getting excited. And I do mean that in a negative way. They’re, what’s the terminology getting spun up about the whole thing of bird flu this and bird flu that it’s jumping to this. And then it’s not gonna be a matter of time before it jumps to humans who have another pandemic, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

I I think as food safety professionals, we, instead of jumping up and down and following the latest thing that comes out from whoever is that we, I think that we need to put the little, the tinfoil hat on a little bit and have a decent amount of skepticism with regards to, agendas and things that are being pushed on us. Because if you cast your mind back to the start of the, you know, the one in a hundred year pandemic, there was talk and a huge concern that this virus or bug or or whatever it was could be spread or would could would remain on frozen food products for two weeks.

And you know that that was a source of transmission for an outbreak overseas. And, you know, I remember that was way back in the early days of of of my food safety career. So, yep, I haven’t been doing it that long. It was, you know, just something that everyone is getting excited about. And it’s just like, hang on. Maybe we need to think about something. And just, you know, take a step back, have a breath rather than just following along with what, you know, propaganda is coming out. Now, as I did say in a previous episode, I’m a devout anarchist. I do not I’m yet to be convinced that the government having control or input in something or regulating something actually benefits the consumer.

It normally benefits, particular industries or particular industry groups, and and as such as particular businesses and the government themselves. So it’s the thing is I mean, you know, have a look at, the the previous article about a restaurant, based, you know, inspected two separate occasions and yet still in a bad way. But anyway, so, yeah, I I I think that we do need to be aware and and pay attention to what’s going on and just take a step back, have a breath, and, you know, just don’t hook your, you know, hook your wagon up to whatever trains are going around. Anyway, that being said, I think we’re gonna start with the main bit of the show, which what for twenty, let’s say, twenty four minutes about a whole lot of other stuff. And I don’t think this big is gonna be that long. So anyway, it’s the main point now.

What am I talking about? I’m talking about auditor management. As food safety professionals in our businesses, we will be audited. There’s not a will be and not a a when or an if. It’s a you will be audited. It’s either the, local government inspector comes around, and that’s an inspection rather than an audit. Or it’s, you know, if you’re, got a HACCP standard, you’ll have an order to come around to review or you, how your business activities compare to, that’s standard. If you’re s q f, you’ll have, the s q f audits. Not only enter food safety and if you supply the majors, I think normally they want quality.

But then again, it just depends on whether you’re a food manufacturer, a prime producer, etcetera, etcetera, as to what sort of audit you’ll get with that. B r c g e s t u v w x y zed, have their audits. Said x has their audits. If s s s s c’s and twos and zeros, they have their audits. And, you know, it it’s the thing. It can be quite daunting. And, I’ll admit that the first time I went through one, it was just sort of hoisted upon me, relatively new. Actually, I was brand new in the business and was just told, hey. Yep. There’s an audit that you’re gonna sit on and and, assist the person with. It’s like, okay.

But nowadays, getting to be a bit old hat at it. They are still a bit nerve wracking because you, you know, you you’re going everything again. Oh, did I what did I miss? And and have a look through everything and you think, oh, jeez. I’ve missed this for the last period of time. Oh, boy. You know, if the order looks under that rug, we’re in trouble here. But if the order looks around that corner there, we’re in trouble there. So, you know, we’ll admit they are a bit nerve wracking. That normally comes down to you write your your own inability to follow the systems that you have set up. So like the management systems and everything like that.

If you’ve gone to the point where you’ve followed the systems that you’ve set in place and everything is working right and there hasn’t been a breakdown in the system. And I’m not talking about a cast catastrophic breakdown. There there will be little bits where, you know, certain things have been missed or anything like that. And that’s when it’s handy to have someone external from the person who’s controlling the the system to audit, you know, to do, you know, you do your own internal s q f audit, see what bits are lacking, and then you can prepare yourself better for the next order that comes through.

Now, having said that, how do you manage auditors? It’s the thing. You know, obviously, you know, one thing you gotta remember first and foremost, auditors are there, you know, they’re people. Some have agendas. You should talk to auditors respectfully, especially when it comes to an unannounced audit. And it’s, you know, I think most cycles do one one every three years. There’s gotta be an an unannounced audit. Thing with that is is that, you know, you’ve you have to continue because I would not I speak from experience. So you got a two month window where the auditor could rock up at any day and just, you know, we’re here to audit the business.

I think from that perspective, I mean, you don’t put your life on hold. You continue going as you normally do. If the auditor rocks up, you know, let’s say your production day starts at 05:00 and the auditor rocks up at 09:00. Well, I think you need better turn around to the auditor and say, you know, make it clear. Hey. You know what? You’ve turned up unannounced. We start early. We’re not staying back late. We cannot stay back late. And that, from that perspective is that the order, so it needs to turn around and say, yep. You know what? We accept this. And, you know, move along to the second day. Second day, You can’t really use that excuse because you know, the audit is happening.

My suggestion would be to talk to the auditor and and so you know, let’s say your production day starts at five. Not many audit is willing to turn up at 05:00 in the morning, but, you know, you could turn around and say, alright. Hey. Let’s kick off at six. That way, you know, if if you go in an hour later or or anything like that, you go through that process. So it’s the thing. There there needs to be more flexibility with the auditors in in it, you know, acknowledging that they’re coming into your business and that you’re the one that has everything set up. You’re the one that is operating there. So, you, you know, there’s there’s times where you may need to remind the auditors of that.

So yeah. So it’s the thing. Don’t don’t be deliberately or you say obstructionist and turn around and say no 05:00 it is or you you know, you can’t come in. Well, you kick an audit around, and I think it’s a a bigger drama than anything else. The next bit is is when you’re going through the audits. I think a lot of auditors are either what would you say? And, you know, you haven’t spoken to other people about this. I’m trying to find that through what was the terminology that was used? Superficial or first level? You know, they they just look for that low hanging fruit rather than digging deeper into things and and, you know, finding, where the process fell down, which led to the potential, you know, corrective action that they’re looking at or nonconformances or whatever you wanna call them.

So, yeah, it’s it’s there’s that. So, yeah, it’s one of those things is I what is it? Yeah. It’s it’s just challenging. But then yeah. Anyway, not gonna go there. I’ll I’ll just leave that one. But the other thing I do wanna mention is that you’ll see, some say it’s a fine line between an order and an inspection. And then others say, hey, it’s a a broad chasm and how someone can go from an audit to an inspection is, you know, is beyond them. I’m inclined to go with a latter rather than the former. I do think that that is a bit of a bigger divide or separation between the two. So, yeah, it’s it’s yeah.

Not not gonna go too much into that because you hit the only thing I can talk about is, the, bits that we got picked up with, within our audit. And I don’t wanna give that much away. It you know, it it’s it’s the thing. And I’ve been through a couple now. And some some auditors just they’re very black and white in their thinking, and this is the way that the book is. And this is, you know, it’s the, you know, the way that it is. And and, you know, it it is this way, and and nothing you can do can change your mind about it. But then there’s other auditors that, you know, realize that, you know, what is in the book may not necessarily, relate to a real world experience, and they’re aware of that.

And as long as the process is followed, there’s that. But and and the other thing too is that I do wanna talk about is that if there’s something that the auditor is finding, don’t be scared to push back. And, you know, turn around and and, you know, get them to work, get them to justify why they’re giving you a, you know, nonconformance for for whatever it is. Sometimes, yeah, you might oh, you know what? That’s right. Or other times, they’re just going down completely wrong tree. The other thing too is don’t let auditors bluff you. Had one years and years and years and years ago, where the auditor was threatening to give us a lower score, which would put us on a six monthly cycle.

And it we’re already on the six monthly cycle because the system just went we also offer completely. So this was the the six monthly surveillance audit. And, you know, I remember having a bit of a a discussion with the auditor where the auditor turned around and said, oh, well, why are you gonna get down? Honestly, I said, yeah. It doesn’t want me. Go for it. Not worried about it because, you know, there’ll be a recertification audit in another six months time. So it does not worry me, for that, you know, because some people freak out about going on six monthly cycles. But, yeah, it’s it’s an added cost to the business that businesses don’t need to have, and they shouldn’t have it if your system is set up and robust enough. And once once again, the only way you find out if it’s robust is by testing yourself. Do your internal orders, do everything and try and find holes. Be when you do your internal orders, be a little bit pedantic and say, alright. Hey, hang on. This isn’t right here. We’re missing this. And, you know, go go through it where, you know, it’s it’s it’s something that you’re looking at. And, you know, the more the more holes that you pick in your your system yourself, the less holes that there there will be for an external order there to pick up because you’re aware of it. And, okay, you know what? We’ve got a blind spot here, and all that sort of stuff. So, you know, don’t don’t be afraid, to, you know, to to really go hard on yourself, because then you can identify shortfalls and and things that you’ve missed. And then, put things in place to rectify that.

And, well, you know, if there’s something there that the auditor is like, likely to pick up, You can turn around and say, oh, yep. We’re aware of this in here’s a a corrective action that’s been raised for it. And this is what’s happening. Blah blah blah blah. But going back to order to management. Yeah. If you’re on a six monthly cycle, don’t let them bluff you into staying on it. Push back hard and say, you know what? No. We’ve improved since then. You know what? This the score is is too low or whatever. And, you know, don’t don’t be afraid to to challenge the audit findings, for that. So, yeah, it’s it is interesting to deal with with auditors.

And, not gonna say too much, because I don’t want the, you know, the next group of auditors that come through and and just to have big sticks beside them and all that sort of stuff. But then that being said, if they do come in with a big stick, well, they’re not being an auto, then are they? They’re being potentially an inspector or they’re doing something that is not, to to channel You know, the council is not in the vibe of auditing because you’re paying for the service. You’re not paying for someone to come in and just continually bash you. Oh, you’ve done this wrong. You’ve done that wrong. Done that wrong. Is that the auditors there just to to check your systems for this point in time. And, yeah, it it it it’s the thing.

You know, don’t be don’t be afraid to push back. Don’t even you know, if you have a bad audit and you think the auditor was overstepping their mark, don’t be afraid to challenge it. And then even put the auditing body on notice that, hey. You know what? If this continues again, we’re gonna go and look for another one, or we’re gonna go to a a a different auditing body. And, you know, there’s you can do that. There’s nothing that says you have to stick with the same auditing body time and time and time and time again. So yeah. But anyway, that’s about it on that one.

If you’ve got any comments about that, please send me an email. Notes at food dot, food say food safety dot I s t. Getting confused about that one name. For that one, so I’d love to hear your thoughts on managing auditors. Is it something that’s easy to do? Is it something you’re not game enough to do? And things like that. So anyway, this part of the show is where I tell everyone that this is a value for value podcast. This is a podcast that is created for you, the fellow food safetyists. I’m not taking any advertising in this for that one because I do wanna be able to talk to you honestly and be independent of all the other organizations out there.

And it’s it’s something that we for those of us who are food safetyists and, you know, just moving into the whole food safety realm, you know, don’t have the career or maybe we’re not making it as a career. We’re just dabbling on the side of it or anything like that. We need to have a I won’t say dissenting voice, but more of a voice of of reality, among things. So, you know, this is what this podcast is here for. So, as I said, value for value, this runs on your contributions, which could be in time, talent, or treasure. If you’ve got time, share this podcast with other people, tell people about it, spend your time sending me an email, notes@foodsafety.ist.

Tell me what you think. Give me any tips about anything that you’d like to see on a future episode. Anything like that. Talent, hey. You can help spruce up the website a bit. You could do all sorts of things. Well, there’s a treasure part where you donate some some hard earned money. Now everything that you see on this, the podcast and the website is free. There’s no, subscriber only content. It is all premium content that I will put out and do put out for for you, the listener. So I’m not gonna hide anything anywhere. Not buying pay walls or anything like that. So, you know, this this is the thing is that I I understand why they do it, but it sort of does confuse me a little bit. And it does, concern me that, you know, everything is is you know, if food safety if you’re if you’re in the food safety realm and you’re hiding important stuff behind a paywall, you know, are you really focusing on food safety or just focusing on revenue? And that’s that’s, you know, it it it’s just something that, does get up my garden a little bit. But anyway, I think I might end it here now, before I get my soapbox and all that sort of stuff. So anyway, folks, thank you for listening to this, episode six of the Food Safety Podcast.

I’m Cameron Blewett, and I look forward to having you join me on the next one. So, folks, until next time. Bye for now.